Mark Weinberger is the Global Chairman & CEO of EY, a leading global professional services organization that provides assurance, tax, transaction and advisory services. With 190,000 people in more than 150 countries, EY is one of the largest professional services organizations in the world. Weinberger, during a recent visit in Rome conceded this interview to Italy24-IlSole24Ore.
BUFACCHI: Italy is back into recession. There are many structural reforms on Matteo Renzi's table. Italy needs all of them: but would you agree that the most important reform, the number one, is the labour market reform?
WEINBERGER: First of all the prime minister needs to convince investors and the public that Italy is operative for business. We have been talking about reforms for a long time so the key will be the proof of execution. The labor market reform is high in the list but so is the streamlining of the administrative reforms Renzi intends to do. Making it easier to opening a business, making it easier to conduct business. Getting rid of the three layers of government on reviews. This is all very very important. However, it is up to the politicians to decide which is the easiest, politically, to get done first. That is important as well because you have to show progress: this is what will start to convince the world that you are making progress. So while theoretically economists and businesspeople can say “do this one first” I think what is important is for the government to assess what could be done the quickest and then get it done. That starts the momentum for other reforms.
BUFACCHI: Implementation and delivery is very important. Do you think that Italy has a problem in showing that reforms get done? The pension reform went almost unnoticed. Is there a way a government can demonstrate progress?
WEINBERGER: The importance of the reforms is not to deal with the current crisis. It is for the long term success of Italy. These reforms are necessary because we are looking at ten years of reduced GDP for Italy. This is not to address the current recession. This is setting Italy on a path for growth over the long term. So I think if we saw progress on the big picture issues, not fully resolving them necessarily, but if we saw there are real new laws moving into the system on labor reforms, making it easier to remove and hiring workers…
BUFACCHI: “Unlock Italy” just became law: it aims to attract foreign investments on infrastructure. There have always been great expectations on public-private-partnerships, project bonds: but they never took off.
WEINBERGER: The prime minister has two responsibilities: one is getting the reform laws passed through the government; the other is working directly with the business community, to get them involved, and almost lobby them like he is lobbying the government to take advantage of the public-private partnership, to take advantage of investment opportunities in Italy. He should do what he does with politicians, go out, meet the businessmen , invite them in .
BUFACCHI: Renzi knows how to speak to the people and to the electorate and you are saying he should do the same with the business community. But what about Brussels: should Renzi engage in a closer dialogue with the European Commission and European institutions? Can Italy make it on its own or should it seek the support of Europe?
WEINBERGER: The problem right now in Europe is that every country has its own unique issues. Germany is slowing down, other peripheral countries like Spain and Portugal have problems, France has similar issues… so I do not know whether Italy can wait for Europe to reform. I think Italy will have to move on its own. I really do think if Italy waited for Europe to come in, it would be more lost time. I think Italy needs to take its future in its own hands.
BUFACCHI: The rules in Europe have been stretched, rules such as the fiscal compact and the Maastricht Treaty: do you think these rules should be respected in full?
WEINBERGER: Europe has put in place rules to provide discipline. This is necessary for the long term. If every country with a problem were offered to ignore the rules, then there would be a lack of trust between the European countries. So I think the prime minister Renzi is doing it in the right way, trying to work with France to get more room of manoeuvre and trying to be respectful of the rules at the same time. And making the case hard for growth and not austerity at this point in time. You cannot afford to have countries such as France or Italy, the second and third largest GDPs in Europe, with systemic problems and to have at the same time a successful Europe. Both countries will have to work on their issues. France's issues are similar and different from Italy's. They have a very strong infrastructure, a very good education system, some degree of entrepreneurial culture and R&D. But France's government is paralyzed as well in making the additional reforms that are necessary, and particularly cutting spending so taxes could go down and the cost of labor would be lower. They have a job deficit, they have to reduce the cost of labor to make it more flexible so companies can hire workers.
BUFACCHI: Italy has to lower corporate taxes as well: this is what the Italian business community has been asking for a long time. But it is hard to cut public spending so Italy seems to be stuck on this issue too.
WEINBERGER:Yes, taxes is an issue but in Italy you also have another problem: the huge amount of time and efforts needed to cope with bureaucracy at all levels. Since the birth of a business - in Italy it takes weeks to start a company while it takes only 4 days in the UK - the administrative burden of getting all the approvals necessary at every level of government consumes time and energy that entrepreneurs should be spending on their business. That is a bigger tax than taxes themselves. The other element that you do not see in Italy is innovation and R&D . Italy does not have a strong focus in attracting innovation and R&D. If you look at the Silicon Valley, at Shanghai, if you look at the UK what it has done with patent boxes to attract R&D... These are the kind of things that will be important for Italy to focus on as well.
BUFACCHI: Europe needs time to come out of the economic crisis through structural reforms. And it needs time to create a capital market. This is why financial markets are now hoping that Draghi's ECB will take Europe out of the woods with a full scale QE. What is your view on the effectiveness of QE?
WEINBERGER: I think QE is a tool that we have become accustomed to, which does help to provide liquidity. It is no substitute for the fundamental reforms that have to occur in many European countries. Europe needs financial reforms: it has to create a capital market, improving lending via venture capital, create new lending vehicles. But this is separate from QE. QE is a lift to the marketplace through artificially low interest rates. In the US the stock market is going very well: why? Because through QE interest rates have become so low that people are moving up the risk curve to invest in more risky assets. The US is more lucky, compared to Europe, because it went back to growth more quickly compared to Europe. The point I want to make is that QE is not going to create growth, it is going to increase liquidity to provide you with time so that you can make the fundamental reforms. I am not against QE I am just saying it is not the answer to everything.